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Tension gage / no tension gage ?

Posted by Jim B on 10/27/10


I want to see how you guys go about setting the tension on your back springs. Do you guys use a gage ? How many grams of tension do you put for a long stroke shader and a short stroke shader ? Or do you guys do it like me and do it by feel ? If doing it by feel how do you go about it and how high does your armature bar sit from the front coil on your short and long stroke shader.. Your favorite machines and there tension gaps from coils with no contact screw touching ? Who uses a tension gage and if so what numbers and who thinks a tension gage is a worthless tool since so many factors come into play with different machines and springs so a one number for all is pointless. I'm interested in seeing what fellow tattoo artists think and how they go about it.



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RE:Tension gage / no tension gage ?

Posted by Don't feed the animals on 10/29/10


I'm no machine expert by any means but I use a gauge to retune my machines what I believe is you gotta buy good machines from reputable builders that's the starting point they know the why this is setup the way it is for that specific machine and they sell all the replacement parts for that specific machine when I first get the machine I will measure rear spring tension with the gauge as well as the numbers on my meter and I'll write em all down rear spring gauge,rear spring tension,cps,duty,ft,all numbers I can front spring gauge,air gap,point gap,everything and I simply replicate those numbers if I want to change something I can and still have all the info to get it back where it was it's helps me in my tuning


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RE:Tension gage / no tension gage ?

Posted by ironwolf13 on 10/29/10


I agree 100% to writing down the setting all the numbers when you get a new machine and when you change thing you can go back and set it back where you had it before . I have nice a lot of guys on here are talking about machine setting well how about investing in a few or about different sizes and weight armature bar's and spring's and set them up and have about 5 to 10 machine to test out with different set ups with coil's and different capacitor and maybe you well find out your sweet spot you like if you like a a fast or a slower liner or shader with different stroke and the right throw this well help you trouble shooting out a lot of thing . hope this would help


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RE:Tension gage / no tension gage ?

Posted by ironwolf13 on 10/29/10


sorry typo


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RE:Tension gage / no tension gage ?

Posted by Will D on 10/29/10


I agree a tension gage can be used to mark a machine you bought tuned along with spring length and gage. This way you can get back to that tune. Danny fowler has a video out saying 375 to 450 grams is for all machines and that i dont agree with. You cant take a tension gage and just add whatever grams Fowler says to it and your good to go. Just like FK said that there are to many variables with machines and there all different so you cant use a gage to set a machine. The coils , spring gage , spring length from spring deck to armature bar , cap and many other things vary from machine to machine so a tension gage # for all machines wont work. A eikon meter or any one with readouts can help you 100% more to tune a machine then a tension gage can just like FK said and he is a amazing builder. So i would have to say NO to a tension gage to tune your machine, only good for marking it down for a machine tuned already along with marking down the other variables with that machine. You can just mark down the tension by checking the air gap so a gage is no good to me. Say 400 grams of tension you thought was good but when you put that on another machine it will not be the same unless its EXACTLY the same machine and specs are exactly the same as well. I have used one long ago in my shop and checked my co workers tensions to see how close they were to the recomended tension Fowler gives and not one machine was even close to what he says. Thats when i put it away and have not touched it since. I have not seen any tattoo artist i know using one to TUNE a machine or have i heard of a builder using one. Listen to what FK said, buy your self a eikon power supply or one with readouts and learn and tune with that. Thats just my experience and my 2 cents about it. I would say for tuning a machine , it cant. I would have to say NO tension gage, not needed cause you can just mark the gap. Hope that helps


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RE:Tension gage / no tension gage ?

Posted by Jim b on 11/01/10


Dontfeedanimals , i do agree with you i do the same thing. Rock n Roll answer , nobody has answered here to much. I guess most people are dick heads on here and cant help another tattoo artist out and they have to big of egos. What tension # do your short stroke machines have or a around #. I know that it varies but spring size and tension could give me a idea. Even if its a big range like a guide:line #. I have been done with my apprentice for a year and i tattoo allot now, just looking to play around , get some ideas you know learn more. Most of the guys on here can help but do not care to help a tattoo artist. Kinda a shit biz makes us look bad with the egos thinking we are better and cant help . But i am a tattoo artist and help who i can if i know the answer so i am not a dick head like the rest.


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RE:Tension gage / no tension gage ?

Posted by Jim b on 11/04/10


I cant belive how many tattoo artists dont know how to tune a machine. No comments about this cause everyone buys there machines tunned i see. You guys need to learn the machine and then you can tune like the $500 next gen machine you buy with a $50 frame and $50 on
parts. Its a shame how they all are professionals but they know nothing about tuning. This forum sucks , way better long ago , bunch of no skill people now days should get fired for not knowing a machine and lack of knowledge for a tool youu usse 24/7 nub duckets your all worthless no nothings that pay for a new machine cause you dont know how to turn a screw , add or subtract tenssionns and all tht stuff you so called professionals use. I was forced to know my machine inside and out and its real sad now days that nobody knows shit about a machine. Got a million replys about stupid stuff like " this happen at my shop today" yeah someone came in and caused a seen . You guys make this forum suck, all of the old topics actually have good info and artists helping artists now ya got a bunch of guys crying and bitching about shit. Shame on YOU so called artist


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RE:Tension gage / no tension gage ?

Posted by Stephen Griffin on 11/04/10


Jim, who are you talking to? Are you the same guy who keeps bumping up 2 year old posts and then waging a one man war against anyone with a machine based question? Get over it, guy.What the hell do you care if someone doesn't wanna look at their numbers? Or doesn't have a power supply with readouts, period? That says nothing of their art! I've read interviews with some of the best artists in the business say they could care less about numbers. Sounds like something in your personal life is pissing you off and you wanna vent. Which is fine, but don't take it out on us! Some of us actually enjoy reading posts about anecdotal stories dealing with the day to day happenings of our peers. If you hate this forum so much, I hope Nick will let you out of your contract that says you MUST VISIT HIS FORUM. But clearly you think he knows nothing as well, since he also said earlier in this thread that if the machine is running well, but the numbers aren't where their "supposed to be" to just leave it alone. I've noticed that the guys who are overly obsessed with their equipment and numbers usually leave something to be desired in their own artwork. Oh, is this a broad statement? Hi, I'm REASON, nice to meet you. Chillax and breathe for a moment before bumping up out dated threads and then railing against the people that posted them (who may or may not even frequent this forum anymore). otherwise, have fun in your one man army. Hope it all works out for you.


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RE:Tension gage / no tension gage ?

Posted by Stephen Griffin on 11/04/10


The thread I was talking about with Nick was the duty cycle one, but the last post on there sounded very much like the one you just left. I really don't wanna get into a whole big thing about it, cause you clearly think everyone on here is a know-nothing-dickhead, but what difference does it make if someone has different preferences with regards to machine tuning than you do?


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RE:Tension gage / no tension gage ?

Posted by Jim b on 11/05/10


I can bump them up if i want who cares if i do or not what is the big deal. You dont like it dont comment. The artists that say they dont care about numbers dont know what numbers mean. They buy there machines tuned and know nothing about machanical harmonics. I see this every where , tattoo artists talking about not knowing how to tune a machine. All that is , just cause you hear someone say ithey dont care for it dont mean they are write, just means they dont know. Allot of people agree with me or atleast most builders do. Regardles i am sorry to upset you i have just been really stressed out with family problems and have been taking my anger out on this forum. I appologize sincerly to any artists i offended, i am nearly trying to push them to learn instead of paying for a machine they could tune if they knew how. If someone says they dont care about numbers they means they dont care , not that they mean nothing. Numbers are just science of the machine plain and simple and just cause someone dont care cause they focus on art doesnt mean numbers dont mean anything. Old school artists are the ones who dont care cause they dont undeestand physics and science. Half the shit i write i dont remember cause i just go off when i hear artists talkin bad about stuff they dont understand or dont "care" about. Its all about a lack of knowledge, lack of physics, lack of everything to do with a machine. I appologize for my rants i wont be on here anymore anyway, i have been sick at home and will be returning to work tomorow. Feel is all in the volts to me, i can change the volts and make any machine hit like another. Dont get so upset , be happy someone that understands machanical harmonics is helping by telling about stuff that took years to learn on a forum none the less. All i see is hate on this forum now days and nobody helping anyone anymore. Appologizz again for upseting you. Bye


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RE:Tension gage / no tension gage ?

Posted by Jim b on 11/05/10


Another thing is you noticed wrong, the guys who are overly obsessed with numbers and physics are machine builders and artists that understand the science and what a machine does. Has nothing to do with art , tattooing or any other nonsense. Who do you know that "cares" about the machine that has shity tattoo skill ? Are you god , you can see there work in your head. I see that the guys who know nothing about a tattoo machine,physics, science,facts,tests buy machines tuned , cause they cant tune themselves , are the ones who dont care about numbers. Your art skill alone cant give you a great tattoo. You should know this, thats why you buy you spend $500 on a tuned machine from someone that uses a meter to tune them.


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RE:Tension gage / no tension gage ?

Posted by brian on 11/05/10


jimb youre rigth man ,im with you absolutely


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RE:Tension gage / no tension gage ?

Posted by stephen griffin on 11/05/10


You would, Brian. And its RIGHT not rigth.


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RE:Tension gage / no tension gage ?

Posted by Jim b on 11/05/10


brian obviously understands because he knows how to tune a machine,any and all machines, a shit $50 machine to a $700 machine,don't matter cause he understand physics, mechanical harmonics , how machine work inside and out.

@ stephen All the things you read about them saying they care less about numbers mean they dont tune there machine, they care about the tattooing part not the science , like you , so stay away from machine tuning talk cause you know nothing. The machines they all use are tunned by builders who CARE about numbrs ,science,tests,facts,physics , harmonics and it all. Myabe you should learn more cause you think them saying this in a mag means numbers mean nothing. To the one who buys them tuned ,yes they dont matter, ()() To the ones who build and tune them to sell to the artist you talk about YES they do matter


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RE:Tension gage / no tension gage ?

Posted by stephen griffin on 11/06/10


Yeah, Brian knows how to tune any machine. You're retarded. I do care about numbers but not enough to give a shit if someone else doesn't!


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RE:Tension gage / no tension gage ?

Posted by brian on 11/06/10


hey jimb take a look in griffin work and than you gonna stop waist time with him,this man dont now nothing about tattoo process


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RE:Tension gage / no tension gage ?

Posted by paulsxm on 11/06/10


this fucking little girls never stops


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RE:Tension gage / no tension gage ?

Posted by paulsxm on 11/06/10


IGNORE BRIAN!!


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RE:Tension gage / no tension gage ?

Posted by paulsxm on 11/06/10


(now my grammar goes, reading to much brian)
i meant 'little girl'. yes, you brian)


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RE:Tension gage / no tension gage ?

Posted by Jim b on 11/06/10


Your retarded , pussy, you sound real cool , i could give a fuck if people dont kno how to tune to optimum performance, all i do is try to help ,, you talk lot shit like you run this forum, go fuck you self bitch , you say only crap art artist care bout number , so you call FK bad tattoo artist, you think you know all ,,,,, you know NOTHING about machin tunning or tuning to optimom performance you showed that, just cause you buy your machine tune and kno little dont meen guys on here dont care , you the one on here going around talk shit to artists. So fuck you im sick of your fucking mouth bitchh , You go read my last post , you the one that take what artists say about not caring for numbers as they have no meaning , sorry bud they dont care cause they dont tune a machine !!!!!!!! They buy tuned machine from builders that use number just like YOUU buy from builder who uses numbers , stay away from machine talk and go bitch at artist somewhere else, stay the fuck away from a tuning or machine topic unles you gonna help, dont write just to bitch and throw your shit tallk in. Think you some amazing machine builder when your far from it, call me retard you fucking pussy fuck you bitch . All i see is you talkin shit to tattoo artists or throwing your brainless opinion in where dont belong. Dont care what he says brian he is a pussy and sucks dick at tattooing and machine tunning


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RE:Tension gage / no tension gage ?

Posted by stephen griffin on 11/06/10


Ah Brian, you little douche. I sure would love to hit you right in the fuckin mouth.


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