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changed to 8 wraps, now machine needs more voltage

Posted by James Dean Jr. from IP: 24.192.166.248 on 07/03/11
Warren, MI United States - website


so i recently got a new machine, the frame was real nice but the coils and some other things could be changed, so im working on rebuilding it, first thing i have done so far is go from 10 wrap coils with a 47uf 50v cpacitor it came with to 8 wraps with a 47uf 35v capacitor, now i would think that my machine would now need less voltage, but since i put the 8 wraps on it runs at around 9.2 volts (w/needle) as opposed to when i had the 10 wraps it was running at about 7.5v...ive just recently been learning more about machines so i would appreciate if someone could tell me why im needing more voltage with less wraps - thanks guys



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RE:changed to 8 wraps, now machine needs more voltage

Posted by Eriksenn from IP: 76.102.188.226 on 07/03/11
Novato, CA United States - website


Well it could be several things really... When you say "other things could be changed too", did you actually change anything but the coils?
Check to see if the front coil is shimmed correctly, and the abar hits flat on it. If it is not hitting flat, the machine is needing more voltage to pull the bar down. Also, all coils are not created equal, so if you switched from decent coils to great ones, or vice versa, the frame/setup/spring tension may react differently. I am a tinkerer, and amateur builder, so maybe someone else could chime in on this!


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RE:changed to 8 wraps, now machine needs more voltage

Posted by James Dean Jr. from IP: 24.192.166.248 on 07/03/11
Warren, MI United States - website


no i haven't changed anything but the coils, and yeah i went from some cheap china made 10 wraps to some 8's from baltimore street irons, with the hex head, the a-bar hits the front coil flat, the only thing that is different is the gap between the a-bar and the rear coil is a tiny bit bigger, don't know how this would effect it or not


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RE:changed to 8 wraps, now machine needs more voltage

Posted by clever thoughts from IP: 173.3.101.173 on 07/04/11
, ny United States - website


Well i would shim the rear coil until there is every small gap from the core to the bar, this should help. I like the smallest gap i can get away with.


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RE:changed to 8 wraps, now machine needs more voltage

Posted by James Dean Jr. from IP: 24.192.166.248 on 07/04/11
Warren, MI United States - website


yeah i figured id have to shim the rear coil up a little, i hear the rule of thumb is there should be the gap of a business card between the rear coil and the a-bar...so if i do ship it up and it still is using more voltage and other ideas out there you guys could help me out with?


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8 wraps

Posted by friar from IP: 65.175.214.69 on 07/05/11
rochester, nh United States - website


Hex heads are bad ass! rear coil spacing/rolling paper folded in half.And ya might wanna go down to a 22 uf cap.


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RE:changed to 8 wraps, now machine needs more voltage

Posted by James Dean Jr. from IP: 24.192.166.248 on 07/08/11
Warren, MI United States - website


yeah i really like the hex heads, and yeah im gonna need to shim up my rear coil, but im using the machine as more of a color packer shader so thats why im running a 47uf


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RE:changed to 8 wraps, now machine needs more voltage

Posted by Lonnie from IP: 50.36.86.115 on 07/11/11
Muskegon, MI United States - website


Did you take the springs and a-bar off when you swapped coils? Is the machine tuned the same?

Sound could be one factor. Different coils can have a very different sound when the a-bar slaps down. Have you tried running it at the absolute lowest voltage before it totally bogs down?

I'm not a numbers guy. I trust my ear and the feel of the machine rather than a set of numbers. If it works smooth at that voltage and the machine is not getting hot, then forget the numbers and just run with it.


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RE:changed to 8 wraps, now machine needs more voltage

Posted by James Dean Jr. from IP: 24.192.166.248 on 07/12/11
Warren, MI United States - website


no i left the springs and a-bar right where they were when i swapped the coils out, it seems to run ok, but it does get a little warm, once i shimmed the rear coil up a little it ran better but right now im also having the problem of the a bar not hitting completely flat on the coil


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RE:changed to 8 wraps, now machine needs more voltage

Posted by friar from IP: 216.246.153.213 on 07/13/11
rochester, nh United States - website


chances are you're tryin to put us standard coils on a chineeze metric frame.


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RE:changed to 8 wraps, now machine needs more voltage

Posted by c downing from IP: 76.5.194.8 on 07/13/11
cape coral, fl United States - website


To me it sounds like you are changing out components arbitrarily. Spend some time learning about how each part works, why they work the way they do and the way changes will effect them and the solutions should become apparent.

You've got a couple different issues going on that may not be related so it's possible a single solution will not fix your problem. Without a basic understanding you can not troubleshoot effectively.


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RE:changed to 8 wraps, now machine needs more voltage

Posted by c downing from IP: 76.5.194.8 on 07/13/11
cape coral, fl United States - website


To me it sounds like you are changing out components arbitrarily. Spend some time learning about how each part works, why they work the way they do and the way changes will effect them and the solutions should become apparent.

You've got a couple different issues going on that may not be related so it's possible a single solution will not fix your problem. Without a basic understanding you can not troubleshoot effectively.


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RE:changed to 8 wraps, now machine needs more voltage

Posted by Mystic from IP: 210.185.12.195 on 08/03/11
Napier, Hawkes Bay New Zealand - website


James
Just because you went down in wraps with coils does not mean you went down in resistance. The 8 wrap coil probably has a way thicker diameter wire then the 10 wrap coil had so has a greater resistance even though it's only 8 wraps, meaning you will need to put more voltage through it to achieve the same performance as the 10 wrap.


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RE:changed to 8 wraps, now machine needs more voltage

Posted by clever thoughts from IP: 68.196.238.50 on 08/08/11
, ny United States - website


Well if the air gap is bigger it will need more voltage. If you make the strokelonger it will need more voltage and that is normal. Try shimming the rear coil until you can only slide a piece of paper in between the core and bar when its pressed down. Hope that helps, disregard what i said earlier, i dont even get what i meant haha. Good luck,


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RE:changed to 8 wraps, now machine needs more voltage

Posted by yaphotstattoostudio from IP: 76.127.78.158 on 01/14/12
Modesto, California United States - website


If your usin a cheap frame and only swappin the coils then your gonna have to fine tune everythin spring tension, air gap, coil shims , etc.


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